Looking for the right neologism

[Ziggy]

Hi

I am some Canadian guy working at a cafe in Seoul. My boss has asked me to translate three soup recipes for her. I leaped at the this opportunity to make outrageous direct translations!

So now I have come to a great opportunity to make a neologism and I'd like some expert advice from fellow learners:

Korean uses counters like 잔 for glass. We do this in English too, but to a lesser degree (mostly I think for uncountable nouns like water or SOUP). In English we have the phrase: "Add a grinding of pepper" but as far as I can tell, Korean doesn't have a counter for "grindings".

Current leading candidate for "grindings" is: 빻음

from the verb to grind made into a noun form similar to 모임. A quick naver search has revealed that 한 모임 gets used, so I think 후추 한 빻음을 넣어 뒤섞다. is an acceptable translation of "add a grinding of black pepper"

Help with Neologismatic fun!

z.

[yhenry]

Hi
In English we have the phrase: "Add a grinding of pepper" but as far as I can tell, Korean doesn't have a counter for "grindings".
Current leading candidate for "grindings" is: 빻음

from the verb to grind made into a noun form similar to 모임. A quick naver search has revealed that 한 모임 gets used, so I think 후추 한 빻음을 넣어 뒤섞다. is an acceptable translation of "add a grinding of black pepper.

Yes, we have one, 갈다, for grinding, although we are unfamiliar with the action of grinding pepper over food which is an Western style, not ours.

I am not familiar with those cook book words but I would say like this;
후추를 적당히 갈아 넣어 뒤섞다

후추 한 빻음을 넣어 뒤섞다. very awkward.
If not grinding but sprinkling, you can say 후추 조금 뿌려 넣어 뒤섞다

Am I sounding like a chef, good enough to run a cooking class?

[Ziggy]

Hi

You do sound like a chef!

So in Korean there are counter nouns, like 맥주 한잔 or 두명. They are nouns that are added onto a number when you are counting. If I wanted to say "one more glass of beer" I might say 맥주 한잔더 주세요!

I am specifically looking to make up a new word which would serve that grammatical purpose in sentences and would be used in the Korean translation of the English phrase "one more grinding of pepper please" (which you might say to a waiter at an Italian restaurant who is grinding pepper over your pasta).

I don't necessarily want to know what the most natural way of saying that would be. I want to make up a new word that is a non-existent but potential Korean word (in English, for instance, the word porple is not a word, but it is could be if someone gave it a definition and started using it).

So I suggested 빻음 because I saw 모임 used as a counter in "한 모임". But you say that 갈다 is another noun for grinding? So potentially 갈음 might be a possibility?

Hey on a related note! In English we use verbs as collective nouns (a grinding of, a springkling of, a shaving of). Does this ever happen at all in Korean?

Thanks!

z.

[yhenry]

So in Korean there are counter nouns, like 맥주 한잔 or 두명. They are nouns that are added onto a number when you are counting. If I wanted to say "one more glass of beer" I might say 맥주 한잔더 주세요!

I guess you know how to count numbers in Korean, but for others who just got here I pained to write these.
1 = 일 2 = 이 3 = 삼 4 = 사 5 = 오 6 = 육 7 = 칠 8 = 팔 9 = 구 10 = 십
1 = 하나 2 = 둘 3 = 셋 4 = 넷 5 = 다섯 = 여섯 7 = 일곱 8 = 여덟 9 = 아홉 10 = 열

As you know already, we don't say 하나잔 or 일잔 or 둘병, unless otherwise being funny.
We love to conjure(?) the basic form into something different and use the conjugated form depending on the situation.
That is embedded language habit that cannot be changed over night.

I am specifically looking to make up a new word which would serve that grammatical purpose in sentences and would be used in the Korean translation of the English phrase "one more grinding of pepper please" (which you might say to a waiter at an Italian restaurant who is grinding pepper over your pasta).

One thing about Language habit is that what is right is not necessarily being right with the grammar rule but how people say or use.
It is the usage, that really counts.

You can make up all kinds of new words but, if people don't understand or use them thinking funny or awkward, you are not going to be popular but weirdo.

Another thing about language is that sometimes word-for-word translation is not possible due to lack of corresponding words in between the two languages being translated.

Like I said, we don't grind anything over our food because it is seasoned and cooked already, except adding more salt. That is why we don't have such a expression and would not understand such act if we have never been to a western style 식당.

I don't necessarily want to know what the most natural way of saying that would be. I want to make up a new word that is a non-existent but potential Korean word (in English, for instance, the word porple is not a word, but it is could be if someone gave it a definition and started using it).

You got my blessing but it can't stop your brilliant idea being laughed at or at worst mocked.

So I suggested 빻음 because I saw 모임 used as a counter in "한 모임". But you say that 갈다 is another noun for grinding? So potentially 갈음 might be a possibility?

Yes, you can make noun out of verb that way, but people don't use 빻음 much these days and would feel strange hearing it.
갈 다 is still used and close to grind, while 빻 다 is not because its root meaning is associated with striking action like hitting grain with a hammer-like object in a container to crush into powder, an ancient way of food processing.

갈다 basically means to rub two together in grinding motion.
You can use it when you sharpen a kitchen knife.

Hey on a related note! In English we use verbs as collective nouns (a grinding of, a springkling of, a shaving of). Does this ever happen at all in Korean? z.

I don't seem to get it. Maybe I need to smell the coffee and wake up.
Or was it your 'Z' made me fuzzy?XD
Please hit me with more examples, or usage in a full sentence.

HenryZZZZZZZZ

PS, let me know if any of my expression sounds awkward. Please don't feel that it is politically right not to point out or correct the funny usages I invented, for the sake of doing the right thing.

[Pamela246]

Hmmmmmmmmm, - personaly, I have never come across the term "a grinding of" but I have heard "a pinch of" when referring to recipes - maybe that is the term you should be looking for?

[holdfast]

or how about a dash? ㅋㅋㅋ..

i don't know how you would say that in korean, though.

and i for one like the z. i often use zzzzz to laugh when i forget (or am too lazy) to switch keyboard inputs... zzzzzzz..

[yhenry]

Hmmmmmmmmm, - personaly, I have never come across the term "a grinding of" but I have heard "a pinch of" when referring to recipes - maybe that is the term you should be looking for?

My wife has the grinding thingy to dash pepper across the plate, but seldom uses it.
Rather, we use the pepper bottle to shake loose over our food, whenever we endanger(?) ourselves into western food.

Who in the world use two fingers to pinch a small amount of pepper to sprinkle over a dish?

So, for 'a pinch of' or 'dash of', we Korean can use '살짝/조금 뿌리다/치다'

소금을/후추를 살짝 쳐서 드세요(eat)/비비세요(mix)

꼬추가루(hot pepper power)쳐 (add, apply)드세요 (eat)

If you hear 처먹어, you are hearing a bad expression for 'eat'.
Of course you can say it with a smile to a close friend, meaning to be funny, a bad sense of humor though.