help with the usage of 시

[crimsonng4918]

Hello Everybody!

I'm new here~

anyway i would like to ask some questions i have encountered..

I was listening to IU's You and I, and come across to this two lines from the song

1) 너랑 나랑은 지금 안돼지
2) 너랑 나랑은 조금 남았지

I understand partially that 안돼 means "cannot" and 남았 means "remained" (past tense of 남다) , so what is the function of 지 in both cases?

PS. I have read up on some website on the conjugation A/V + 시요. Does the above cases fall into this conjugation? or is there something else that I do not know of?

Thank you!! =)

[trutherous]

re: verb ending 지, 지요, 죠

There are a number of verb ending in Korean that, depending on context and intonation, express quite a number of subtle nuance. These should be studied together as one lesson in order to get the most out of your Korean language training. Here are a few examples (by no means a complete lesson), with some possible nuances:

~~어, 어요 - it is, there is/does (plain statement)
~~거든, 거든요 - of course it is/does (see the evidence is obvious/I've got proof) of course I do (matter-of-fact statement)
~~군, 구나, 군요 - it is!(oh wow!) (surprise)
~~데, 데요 - it is (and/because/you know), it is (for that reason) (explanation)
~~네, 네요 - (oh my!) it is/does (pleasantly surprised -somewhat feminine)

~~지, 지요, 지+요=죠 - (statement) it is/does (that's obvious) --or-- (question) does (doesn't) it? is (isn't) it? (seeks agreement from the listener)

~~이, 하, 있, 했, 잖아? 잖아요? (~~지(it is?) + 않아(not)요 = - isn't it? doesn't it? didn't (you/I)? don't (you/I)? --or-- obviously it is!

너 했지? - you did it didn't you?
나 했지 - (of course) I did it (already)

-----sometimes a thing that appears simple turns out to be the most difficult
-----something on level 1 may not be clearly understood until one reaches level 50, the important thing is to keep climbing

Keep up the good work and have fun studying Korean.

[kc101com]

Hello crimsonng4918,


Thank you for your comment and we are appreciated.

Thanks to @trutherous, he had explained to you very good!:)

It is absolutely true that there are many ways to end the sentence in Korean and what you have wondered is also one of them.

It doesn't really change anything special, only the nuance of the sentence!

Quite cute way to end so that's why it is well-used in K-pop and especially female songs like IUs!:)

Glad you picked it up from the Korean song! That's one of best ways to learn Korean


Keep it up!:)


Thank you

Madison
Koreanclass101.com


p.s. we always appreciate trutherous help!

[crimsonng4918]

Thanks to the previous reply! (and I realized that my topic is 시 not 지 ... my bad)

Anyway I have just a small inquiry...I was watching some variety show and heard a particular idol saying " 누구지"

In this case, how would I go about understanding this phrase 누구지?

[trutherous]

who's that? 누구지? Who might that be?

[crimsonng4918]

oh,

so when it carries a nuance of like " I wonder" ? >< seems confusing.

Although my following question is out of topic..I would like to ask about the usage of 서, i understand it has a meaning of "because" " and so"
what about in this case, 혼자서 VS 혼자 . Is there any difference?

I'm self-learning Korean Language so everything seems confusing >< ><

Thank you!! =D

[trutherous]

Although my following question is out of topic..I would like to ask about the usage of 서, i understand it has a meaning of "because" " and so"
what about in this case, 혼자서 VS 혼자 . Is there any difference?

혼자서 VS 혼자 . Is there any difference? 혼자서- all by myself, all by himself 혼자-alone, individually

서 has several meanings depending on use, look at the following sentence:

말을 배우는데 '나는 아무 사람한테서 도움을 받지 않고 혼자서 배워서 이정도로 말할 수 있게 됐다'는 말은 없어요. 우린 많은 사람의 도움을 받고 배우고 가요. When it comes to learning language we cannot say 'Because I learned all by myself, without receiving help from anyone, I can speak to this extent.' We learn as we receive help from many people.

서 -can indicate "from" 한테=to 한테서=from 에게=to 에게서=from
서 -can also mean 'because' or indicate a cause, as you pointed out; however it is not the best way to indicate a reason because it is readily confused with informal verb ending 어 as in 했어, 있어, 먹었어

better ways to indicate a reason:
그 이유는 ~~~
~~기 때문에

take care -- hey why not listen to some Korean music on your commute

[crimsonng4918]

Hmm, I still don't quite understand ><

is 혼자서 a phrase itself? if not, what is the function of 서 in this particular case?

is there any more example that I can differentiate them

Thanks ! (><)

[trutherous]

The difference between 혼자서 and just 혼자 is difficult to explain in English because in this case 서 has no direct English equivalent. Here 서 seems to function as "all by" or "just," and changes the meaning of 'alone' to "single-handed."

나 혼자 있고 싶다 - I want to be alone.

나는 혼자서 그 일을 했어요 - I did that work all by myself.

둘이서 - just the two of us/them

[kc101com]

The difference between 혼자서 and just 혼자 is difficult to explain in English because in this case 서 has no direct English equivalent. Here 서 seems to function as "all by" or "just," and changes the meaning of 'alone' to "single-handed."

나 혼자 있고 싶다 - I want to be alone.

나는 혼자서 그 일을 했어요 - I did that work all by myself.

둘이서 - just the two of us/them

Hi crimsonng4918,


This is Madison from Koreanclass101.com

it's actually very easy!

Let's take an example from what trutherous had given us.

So both basically means by oneself but when you add the extra word, it is when you have object.

So I want to stay by myself - then we do not have object here right.

On the other hand, I did everything by myself - there is an object 'everything'

right?

It's very easy and that's the only difference!;)


Hope this helped,

Thank you

Madison
Koreanclass101.com

[trutherous]

Thank you Madison!!

Exactly! Where there is an action there has got to be a performer of that action, and here 서 seems to change the adjective into an adverb, almost like adding "ly" in describing 'how' the action was performed. I guess since we cannot say 나는 혼자'히' or 혼자'게' 뭐뭐 햇다 we have that 서 which sounds 'so' good ㅋㅋㅋ


나는 혼자서 공부했어요 - I studied all by myself - or - I alone(ly) studied.

우린 두리서 그 일을 했어요 - We did that work together (just the two of us) - or - We together(ly) did that work

원래 '혼자' '두리' '셋이' 란 말은 형용사인가요 수사인가요? 그렇면 '서' 붙이면 부사가 되는 건가요?

[jaehwi]

Hi,

This is Anne from Koreanclass101.com

Thank you for the question.

"혼자서", "둘이서", "셋이서" are subject role in a sentence.

ex; "혼자서 그 일을 하니 힘들다."
However in some cases "혼자서", "둘이서", "셋이서" modify the subject.

ex; "저 혼자서 공부했어요."

Here 혼자서 emphasizes subjcet 저 .


Trutherous 혼자서 한국어 공부해요. That's awesome. Keep it up!!!


Thank you

Anne
Koreanclass101.com

[trutherous]

거봐 --부사잖아요 http://krdic.naver.com/detail.nhn?docid=9996200


'혼자나 혼자서'라는 말은 어떻게 명사를 꾸미는 것 같은지 나도 알고 있지만:

내가 혼자서 (I, all by myself -나의 상태에 대해서 정보를 줌) 그 일을 했다 (did that work) 그러나 이상하게도 '혼자서'는 그 "일을" 어떻게 했다고 알려주는 역할도 하네요.

"나는 그 일을 했다."

나는 빨리 그 일을 했다: 나는 그 일을 빨리 했다
나는 혼자서 그 일을 했다: 나는 그 일을 혼자서 했다

네?

[jaehwi]

맞아요~!

"혼자서"는 문장에서 여러가지 역할을 해요.

명사를 꾸미는 역할도 하고, 동사의 의미를 덧붙여 주기도 해요.

trutherous씨는 한국어를 굉장히 잘 하네요?

대단해요!!

Thanks!

Anne / KoreanClass101.com